‘I’m not swayed at all’: Leaders fail to win over debate audience members

A breast cancer survivor wanted answers after her cancer was missed. A businessman wanted ideas on how to rebuild the economy.

Neither left last night’s NZ Herald Leaders’ Debate with a changed view of the two major parties.

Breast cancer advocate Lisa Eagle and Steel Worx Group director Chris Barrett were in the audience and had their concerns put directly to Labour leader Chris Hipkins and National leader Christopher Luxon by moderator Ryan Bridge.

Eagle’s cancer was missed during a mammogram because she has dense breast tissue, which can make tumours difficult to distinguish from healthy tissue on standard X-rays.

It was picked up nine months later, leading to a mastectomy.

Bridge asked both leaders whether their parties would fund 3D scans for women with dense breast tissue, but they seemed unaware of the issue.

“On the surface of it, I don’t know the medical details of that issue,” Hipkins said.

Luxon also said he didn’t know much about it but would look into it.

Eagle said that didn’t surprise her, as she didn’t realise it was a problem until a scan missed it.

“To know that I had a lump and to come back as clear and go, ‘Oh, I’m fine’, and then … find out down the track … that I’ve got cancer [and] I have to have a mastectomy, it’s scary stuff.”

Although she did not get the answers she wanted, she described the debate as “educational”.

Speaking to media after the debate, Hipkins again acknowledged that he had not been aware of the issue.

“I’m not going to purport to be a medical expert,” he said.

He wanted to make sure the health system had the tools it needed to provide world-class healthcare to all New Zealanders.

“But I’m not going to suddenly appoint myself a doctor.”

Barrett had previously given a scathing assessment of both leaders, telling Ryan Bridge TODAY two months ago that they were “dumb and dumber”.

“One wrecked the economy, the other failed to fix it,” Barrett said then.

Asked about those comments during the debate, Hipkins said, “I disagree.”

Luxon quipped: “It’s really easy to burn a house down, takes time to rebuild it.”

But Barrett remained disillusioned after watching the leaders go head-to-head.

“My view is that the population of New Zealand finds them quite disingenuous,” Barrett said after the debate.

“After all these years, it’s like we’re only wanted on the day that we vote. Other than that, I don’t think they really care. I’m not swayed at all.”

He said the debate did not focus enough on growing the economy, creating jobs and supporting small businesses.

He believed Luxon had made the stronger points and said the National-led coalition “probably needs to have another go”, but was surprised that Labour was more sympathetic to issues “rather than the very extreme left that they seem to have been”.

“We really wanted them to come out and show who they were, and that’s what leadership is. You’re either a lion or you’re a mouse. They both sat somewhere in the middle.

“And that’s why perhaps we’re seeing the country feel like they want to vote for the minor parties over the major parties.”

Katie Bradford is a Senior Correspondent at the Herald. She has been a broadcast journalist for over 20 years and was based in the press gallery for 10 years. She specialises in politics, business and Auckland issues.